We are a commune of inquiring, skeptical, politically centrist, capitalist, anglophile, traditionalist New England Yankee humans, humanoids, and animals with many interests beyond and above politics. Each of us has had a high-school education (or GED), but all had ADD so didn't pay attention very well, especially the dogs. Each one of us does "try my best to be just like I am," and none of us enjoys working for others, including for Maggie, from whom we receive neither a nickel nor a dime. Freedom from nags, cranks, government, do-gooders, control-freaks and idiots is all that we ask for.
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Thursday, July 30. 2015
Big game is hunted all the time in Africa, quite legally. All you have to do is pay and the guides will find a convenient target for all of the Bungalow Bills. Poor schmuck shot the wrong one (but with a bow, to his credit). For real heart-wrenching, ‘It’s Another Boy!’
So we progressively humanize animals and dehumanize people. Something wrong there. I am neither pro-abortion nor anti-all abortion. I have been in a moral limbo about it for years while finding the very idea of abortion spiritually revolting. Abortion is not health care. PP abortions should not be funded by taxpayers. They can abort all the lions they want if they have too many.
care more about animals than about humans is the mark of true
depravity. - See more at:
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I'm repeating what I wrote in an earlier posting about Cecil:
Imagine the global outrage if people were caught sorting through tissue and bits from aborted lions. The horror!
I used to be conflicted about abortion - for me, that was wen I didn't think much about it. Now that I have, I find the whole thing abhorrent on many levels. I find it the height of selfishness that a woman can kill her baby because it is an inconvenience. At the risk of losing pro-life points, I am less opposed to it the sooner after conception - though I am still opposed if the mother is responsible for the situation, which I feel safe in saying is almost all the time.
The Cecil circus that has been going on is just another grotesque double standard that is on display for anybody who opens their eyes. Something that hasn't gotten much attention is that I believe it is a crime to damage an eagle egg. I guess SOME abortions are bad.
Once someone has done a Cecil story, he becomes more real: he has fur, two eyes, is about our size. There is also a long tradition of humanising animals in literature, but this accelerated enormously in the 20th C. We automatically project our own human understandings onto animals, especially mammals. In one way, this illusion is a measure of our humanity, that we have enough surplus empathy that we can imagine the rich lives that they have.
Except of course, they don't.
Cecil would have cared even less for the dentist, and no amount of listening to his screams or playing of tear-jerking movies would have changed that one iota.
The aborted babies don't have this advantage. They have been covered and invisble throughout their existence. There are so many of them as to make them faceless. They aren't cute. Disney hasn't made any movies about their adventures with humorous sidekicks and catchy background music.
Think of the outrage it would generate if someone did an animated humorous adventure film starring cutesy unborn children.
Do I think of animal death as terrible, and imaging animal pain horrifying? Yes, yes I do. But I recognise that this is not very rational. It's based on my own over-empathic nature (training? wiring?) and childhood reading. They aren't people - I only imagine them as such.
"...though I am still opposed if the mother is responsible for the situation, which I feel safe in saying is almost all the time."
Buuuurn the witch!
'So we progressively humanize animals and dehumanize people."
Well said, NJ. We definitely ahve a value system that has gone awry. I can only speculate this is the case because animals don't have a political point of view, and we can project our feelings on them.
Invoking Godwin, the Nazis dehumanized the Poles and the Jews before attacking them. One wonders if the American Left dehumanizes people because they have a similar ambition in mind?
3 abortion stories I have run across in my lifetime (friends/acquaintances):
1) Late 30s woman trying to get pregnant, but had been unsuccessful. Blamed it on the 'abortions' she had when she was younger. Laughed it off as no biggie.
2) Co-worker told me about her mother who had aborted her first baby b/c her mother and father said they were 'too poor.'
3) Friend admitted to me that during a bad period in her life when she was using drugs, she was impregnated by a black drug dealer she'd been hanging around. Never told anyone in her family. She was horridly ashamed. Had depression and cutting issues. Had recently gotten a DUI.
None of these situations seemed to be valid reasons for abortion. I didn't hear one story of rape, incest or abuse. My guess is a majority of abortions are under similar circumstances. Is this really something we should encourage and assist with tax dollars?
I would rather see crisis pregnancy center-type help where abortion is the last, worst option. Where the clinic does everything it can to show the woman/girl that there is support, options, help. (which there is) What if places like PP were rewarded for reducing the number of abortions they perform rather than rewarded? Wouldn't that be nice?
My guess is that most women are ashamed of letting their families and friends know about their mistake and are having a hard time dealing with that 'secret' getting out. Especially teens or college age women. If they are given support and love and counseling, I will bet a majority would keep their babies. This is what we should be striving for...not shrugging our shoulders and saying, "Well, it's going to happen anyway, no matter what we do." That is the coward's way out, in my opinion.
speak for yourself, I don't know who this "we" is, except that it includes you.
holy shi'te, lions have NOTHING to do with aborted babies. who in this solar system thinks there's any moral equivalency just because the lion is in the news at the moment? I mean, WTF????
of all the lame-ass false dilemmas* I've seen anywhere, this is by far the lamest.
while shooting the lion with an arrow causing a prolonged and painful death is bullshit and inhumane (it's not to his "credit" unless you enjoy pain), it has nothing to do with the murder of babies.
see, I can hate both baby killers and stupid dentists, at the same time! without any detraction from either effort. proof positive: tonight we're signing off on another donation to bringing an ultrasound machine to the local womens resource center and I still support the internet mobbing of that dentist and hope they grind him down. this is because I'm not intentionally conflating two wholly different issues to make a muddled third, either that, or ... is this a comedy website?
and you're not in "moral limbo" about abortion, you're still running the cost-benefit analysis -- remember, its a double entry system.
* the OP's argument is so far astray from logical coherence, I'm not sure if they've named this fallacy yet. if they haven't, I propose "the Asshat Fallacy"
Easy does it there, Bear.
Lions and babies have nothing in common other than life. The coincidental and notable contrast is in the public (media) reactions.
Lions and babies have nothing in common other than life.
How so? I look forward to the basis of this clear and convincing truth, especially where it regards the minds and purposes of their killers.
It's all part of the Circle of Life. [© 1994 The Disney Corporation]
The press and much of the public are presenting the dichotomy. We should hear almost nothing about Cecil and far more about hundreds or thousands of ripped asunder babies.
PETA is calling for the lion killer to be tried and hanged. Meanwhile the depravities of PP are addressed by PP filing injunctions (apparently successfully) against the Center for Medical Progress not to release any more videos, and a CA (D) is calling for investigation of the same group. Legal lion hunt versus likely illegal (and depraved) selling of human body parts.
It's the timing, Donny. The PP abortion videos had a head start, but the MSM ignored them. They then went wall-to-wall on the lion story. And the publicity was so much greater, and the dentist hounded and hated, while PP is not.
I knew a couple who'd lived together for several years and when they decided to get married, they discovered they were expecting. She aborted the baby because she said her family would disapprove of her being pregnant before she was married. Then they got pregnant again right after the wedding. It boggled my mind because I was a young mother at the time, and all I could think was, what about the first baby?
Count me among the depraved. Abortion has a strong eugenics effect and should be supported on those grounds alone.
I disagree with the "to his credit" comment regarding using a bow (actually a crossbow from news reports I've heard). If you're going to kill an animal it deserves a quick and clean death and this was the opposite of that. It reportedly took 40 hours to track the wounded lion and finally kill it.
I don't have much respect for trophy hunting but African wildlife has much more to fear from the locals poaching everything that moves so that Asian men can get erection.
I shot a man in Reno
just to watch him die
A fetus is human as opposed to wolf, but is not a human.
Ten, will you go back and learn what the word dichotomy means, please? It's not just a fancy synonym for contrast or irony.
The controversy reminds me of the constant attempt to deflect attention from politically inconvenient stories by complaining that only stories about fashionable outrages are eligible for public attention, a la "Black Lives Matter."
It's always legitimate to point out that we're being hypocritical in indulging outrage over one crime to the exclusion of another, but no crime becomes palatable merely because other crimes also exist. We just get stuck in the pattern of "Abortion is horrible!" "Oh, yeah? What about the death sentence?" or even "Where was your outrage when Bush . . . ."
I can see how you'd not understand correct usage. You still don't grasp the issue.
All the odder when others show that they do grasp it. Because it is.