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Monday, September 3. 2007Multiculturalism: "Arabs don't think like us"To new visitors: Thanks for stopping by, and check us out if you have a minute. You might enjoy our uniquely eclectic (or so we claim) and generally friendly site - even when there is disagreement. In fact, we welcome disagreement and lively but civil debate. Re the topic of multicultural understanding, this commentary which we erroneously attributed to William Haynes, but which is actually from Rants and Raves in 2006 (thanks for the correction, readers). Please read it, friends, and discuss politely:
1) They don't think the same way we do.
No, I mean THEY REALLY DON'T THINK THE SAME WAY WE DO. Yes, yes, I know we are all human and share the same human nature (perhaps the most disastrous mistake of Marxism was the denial of this elementary fact). But within the scope of that shared human nature, there are a lot of different ways to be human. We Americans have a basically open attitude to our fellow human beings and sometimes forget this. Combined with the fact that most Americans are linguistic idiots, we tend to assume that anyone who learns to speak English learns to think like us.
2) When you meet them in just the right circumstances, they are a very likable people.
Arabs are often easy to like, but difficult to respect - as opposed to Israelis, who are often difficult to like but impossible not to respect. From their nomadic heritage they have a tradition of generosity and hospitality to guests that warms the heart. Arab shopkeepers have a talent for making you feel guilty that you didn't buy anything (once you get past a dislike of having them lay hands on you). Haggling is a social grace with them and when you ask the price, and agree to the first one quoted, they will often come down on the price just out of pity for your social ineptness. This does not in the least affect the fact that no friendship with you is ever going to remotely equal the obligations they have for their family, tribe or the community of the Believers.
3) Their values are fundamentally different from ours, their self-esteem is derived from a different source.
And you know what? Theirs is PHONY. Yes I know, I'm making a cultural value judgment, the cardinal sin when I was a grad student in Anthropology. With us, the most important sources of self-esteem are useful work and the love of a good woman. Being good at something that requires skill (even a hobby) and being of primary importance to somebody just because you are who you are. Work for them, is something to be avoided. The basic forms of work: making stuff, growing stuff and moving stuff around, is taken care of by a class of indentured servants, usually non-Arab Muslims from the Third World, and even today, by outright slaves. The Kingdom is a modern country; they abolished slavery in 1967, but old expats have reported seeing slave auctions as late as 1981.
On one occasion a student of mine asked me, "Teacher, what do you call a man who can be sold?" (Excellent use of the passive voice, I was proud of him.) I explained, "He is called a slave, the condition is called slavery, the verb is to enslave." Later I had occasion to ask them about the headsman, the fellow who cuts heads and hands off in chop-chop square in front of the mosque on Fridays. The reason I asked was that from my studies I knew that in tribal societies converting from a tribal or feudal system into a system of common laws, a man condemned to death by a court of law must often be executed by a member of his own tribe, or a complete outsider so that the execution does not spark a blood feud. In the Kingdom the headsman is usually a Sudanese. My students explained, "Yes teacher, he's a slave." i.e. he's a person of no importance and therefore outside the web of obligations of vengeance.
The point being, in a slave society, work is not honorable (as De Tocqueville pointed out) and cannot be a source of self-worth.
In Tunisia I saw a population doing their own work and I have worked with a fair number of Jordanians engaged in skilled labor and the professions. Note that neither is an oil state and I believe their contribution to the ranks of terrorists is far less than the oil-rich countries. It is difficult to argue that poverty is the driving cause of terrorism.
"Of conjugal love they know nothing." (Thomas Jefferson on the French aristocracy.) In a land of arranged marriages, where the whole society is geared towards a strict segregation of the sexes and women are at least semi-chattels, romantic love is rare - and greatly desired. In the Kingdom I found a few students with a consuming interest in romantic poetry, whom I had to teach very discretely. Most of them were just obsessed with sex, however. And interestingly, when visiting the West or the fleshpots of Bahrain, they are said to have a tendency to fall in love with the prostitutes they patronize.
Without honorable work, romantic love or any accomplishments not overshadowed by those the West, their sense of self-worth comes from being the possessors of the One True Religion. And Allah doesn't seem to be delivering on his promises of being exalted above the unbelievers these days.
On the plus side, they are willing to spare you and absorb you into their community as a respected member - if you convert to the One True Religion. The Brotherhood of Believers is a reality in the lands of Islam, and while it sometimes falls short of the ideal (as does our democratic ideal) it is a reality, and in its way admirable.
4) Not only can they not build the infrastructure of a modern society, they can't maintain it either.
The very concept of "maintenance" is foreign to them. This is what drives the foreign instructors in the Gulf absolutely mad. The per capita richest countries in the world resemble Eastern Europe or Latin America in the tackiness and run-down appearance of the buildings and streets. An electronics technician new to the Kingdom once told me how his first job was to inspect a junction box in the desert. He had to pry it open with a crowbar as it had evidently not been opened since it had been installed several years earlier.
This is expressed in the inshallah philosophy, "If God wills it." A Palestinian friend of mine explained to me that even the weather forecaster will qualify his prediction, "It will rain tomorrow. Inshallah." Or, "I will meet you tomorrow, inshallah." (But God understands that I am a very unreliable person.)
I remember giving a pep talk to my students before a crucial exam, "You are all going to pass the exam, right?" "Inshallah teacher." "No, no!" I shouted, "No inshallah. Study!"
This was once also characteristic of the former communist countries. Work was indifferently performed and maintenance was a real problem. A factory owner in Poland told me that machines he bought from Sweden lasted only half as long in Poland as they did in Sweden because of poor maintenance. However as soon as people were assured that they could keep a reasonable amount of what they worked for, people reverted to their true cultural patterns, worked plenty hard and started to take care of their tools and the public spaces.
5) They do not think of obligations as running both ways.
With us, contractual and moral obligations tend to be equal and reciprocal. They don't see it that way. The obligations of the superior to the inferior do not equal those of the inferior to the superior. Obligations within a family or clan outweigh all others. That is why we had to take care not to sit members of the same clan near each other during exams. If one asks another for help, he has to give it, in spite of promises to the school and even when the clansman is a total stranger. Obligations to other believers outweigh all obligations to unbelievers and especially when the believers are fellow-Arabs. And in contracts with unbelievers, the obligations of the Believer to the kaffir are not equal to the obligations of the kaffir to the Believer.
Consider that Muslims in England have quite un-self-consciously demanded that a pub near a Mosque be shut down as offensive to their religion - in spite of the fact that the pub had precedence by six hundred years! Or that they demanded the right to broadcast the prayer call on loudspeakers in London, while it is illegal to have a church at all in the Saudi Kingdom.
6) In warfare, we think they are sneaky cowards, they think we are hypocrites.
In our civilization, when two men get down, either seriously or just "woofing", what do they say? Some variation of "I'm going to kick your ass." Am I right? Here's what I heard in the Kingdom, "Hey, don't f**k with me, or someday you get a knife in the back." I'm not saying that wouldn't happen to you in the West, but most men would be ashamed to make a threat of that nature. We don't understand that direct shock battle is not necessarily the law of nature. When overwhelming force is brought to bear on them, they become cringing and obsequious. To put it bluntly, they lie their heads off to get you to turn your back on them. Try to see it from their point of view - how else do you expect them to act when you have the overwhelming force? You expect them to meet you on equal terms when the situation is so unequal? What other tactics are available but prevarication and delay followed by a sneak attack?
Folks, what we call "terrorism" is quite close to the historically normal way of warfare among these people.
7) In rhetoric, they don't mean to be taken seriously and they don't understand when we do.
Thus an ultimatum is often not taken seriously and the reality comes as a surprise. Remember the "Mother of all Battles"? Like many other Mediterranean peoples, Arabs don't seem to mind making a scene in public and have a high blown sense of drama. Paul Harvey once described how he had spent the Suez Crisis hiding under the bed in his hotel room because of the blood-curdling radio broadcasts, before he learned that Arabs talk like that when they're arguing over a taxi. "This is my taxi and I will defend it to the death!" "You lie, it's mine and rivers of blood will flow in the street before I give up my taxi!"
An Arab will scream at you, get into your personal space and sometimes kick dirt on your shoe - and they react with utter surprise when an American up and decks him. "What did I do?" To say the least, this makes negotiations difficult.
8) They don't place the same value on an abstract conception of Truth as we do, and they routinely believe things of breathtaking absurdity.
I cannot begin to tell you of some of the things I've heard from Gulf Arabs or read in the English language press in the Kingdom. "The Jews want Medina back." (Medina was a Jewish city in the time of the Prophet.) The Protocols of the Elders of Zion has been turned into an immensely popular miniseries on Egyptian TV. The Blood Libel (the medieval myth that Jews need the blood of non-Jewish babies to celebrate Passover) is widely reported in the Arab press, and widely believed. Allah will replenish the oil beneath Arabia when it runs out.
I've been assured, by well-educated and otherwise sensible people that Winston Churchill was Jewish and that Anthony Quinn had been blacklisted and would never work again after making Lion of the Desert (just before he made that turkey with Kevin Costner).
9) They do not have the same notion of cause and effect as we do.
This involves some seriously weird stuff about other people being responsible for their misery because they ill-wished them. I've read in the English-language press of the Kingdom serious admonitions against using Black Magic to win an advantage in a dispute with a neighbor. The columnist did not deny the efficacy of Black Magic, he just said it's forbidden to use it. On one occasion I was trying to explain the concept of "myth" to them and I used the example of the djinn. I wasn't getting through to them at all and was concerned that I had mangled the pronunciation of the word, when it dawned on me that the reason they didn't understand what I was getting at was that they had no doubt that the djinn were real.
10) We take for granted that we are a dominant civilization still on the way up. They are acutely aware that they are a civilization on the skids.
Anyone who looks at the surviving architecture of Moorish Spain can tell that Islamic civilization has seen better days. There was a time when cultural transmission between Islam and the West went overwhelmingly from them to us. (Note the recent discoveries of Sufi symbols engraved on the structural members of European cathedrals.) Now the situation is reversed, and it is humiliating for them.
11) We think that everybody has a right to their own point of view, they think that idea is not only self-evidently absurd, but evil.
In the West, and America more than anyplace else, we have internalized the notion that everyone has a right to their own opinion, and that said opinion is perfectly valid for them. When we meet a people who think that that idea is insane and evil, we are sometimes left in the absurd position of defending their idea as "perfectly valid for them". Doesn't work that way for them; God's Truth is laid out in some detail in the Koran, and not to believe it is a sin. I know, I know, in America you can find lots of Christian Fundamentalists who believe that God will cast you into hell for holding the wrong opinions about Him, but even those who would make their religion into an established church seldom desire the level of enforcement in such detail as the Kingdom does or the Taliban did.
12) Our civilization is destroying theirs. We cannot share a world in peace. They understand this; we have yet to learn it.
Another culturally-imposed blindness we have is the notion that everybody can get along with enough good will. There is absolutely no evidence to support this and a great deal to oppose it. Can the subjugation of women coexist with Western Civilization with Western media ubiquitous throughout the world? Can a pluralistic and tolerant society be governed by Islamic law? Can a modern economy exist where interest is forbidden and many forms of business risk-taking are considered gambling, and thus forbidden? Can a society that educates its young men by a process of rote recitation produce critically thinking, technically educated men to build and operate a modern economy? Can you even teach elementary concepts of maintenance to a people who believe that anything that happens is inshalla (As God wills it)? To compete, or even just survive in the world they must become more like us and less like themselves - and they know this. Saturday, September 09, 2006 Comments
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I’ve yet to meet an arab that I liked. I say this as an Israeli. :)
I say this as a WASP. There is no reson to like Arabs. They are Islamic and want to wipe Israel off the map and they must, according to their ideology and religion kill infidels....how can you possibly like people like that.
It is they who need to be culled to about 50% of their size. I know an arab who is an atheist, and a non-arab who is a muslim.
Explain that. I have yet to meet a single Israeli who deserves existing in this planet with man, beast, or the lowest bacteria.
This comment is obviously made by an Arab Muslim. thats the way they think ( read above). More than likely "John Smith" is a palestinian. And probably has Muhommed somewhere in his name, Since there are really only like 6 different names for Arab Muslim men, and they just switch them around into different orders and combinations to create a "new" name.
I think we should go into Iran, take them over, take their oil, and place Israeli/American overlords and forces in place to protect our mutual interests. Ditto for Iraq and Afghanistan. And when the oil and their usefulness is gone, let then have their sand, camels, goats and sack-covered subjugated women back. When I meet a rattlesnake poised to strike me or mine, I care not one iota for understanding its motivation, nor pause to reflect on its place in the grand scheme of things -- I strike its head off. Death to Islam should be the motto on the breath of any American, and all who exist under Western civilization. Any Westerner not understanding this is a bonafide, self-destructive fool. This is war, people.
This is THE only answer that will end problems from THAT country. If you think otherwise you are naieve and provincial. I have lived among 'em listened closley to 'em and they are telling us what they have in mind. Now how stupid is it if someone tells you they are going to bust open your head not to give some attention to that and prepare to either defend or attack? nothing else will suffice
Just curious:
Does anyone contributing to this column of rants believe: 1) genocide is acceptable under any circumstance? 2) isolationism is a possible "real politik" solution? 3) bigotry or racism is justified ever? Also, is it the intent of the webmaster to provide a forum for racist discussion, or would it be too much to ask that a specific question be posed with regards to the opening essay so that the considerable brain power being used here might be directed towards some societal benefit even if such benefit be infinitesimally small. Just curious in NY. Joe Many of the specifics in this piece were helpful, which does not mean we will all arrive at the same conclusions about the war. The general thrust of the view espoused here is consonant with the reasons some of us thought that Cheney-Rumsfeld's plan for a quick war and replacement of the dictatorship with a modern democracy (or any kind of democracy) were doomed to failure. There were a small but significant number of conservatives who disagreed with the war (e.g., Stephen Chapman), not out of naiveté about Arab-Islamic culture or a liberal world view, but out of morally based realism. Personally, I strongly suspected that the only way the Iraqis would be "pacified" would be to crush them with heavy civilian casualties (essentially, terrorize them) and install a strongman capable of keeping the civilian population under control by relying on unpleasant methods, to say the least.
Some people understood this and thought it was acceptable, but without a more direct threat to the US, others among us thought this was not a morally acceptable course for the United States to take. I know that many people opposed the war for different reasons, and I remember joking with a like-minded friend about some of the liberal opposition to the war, saying that it almost made me want to support the invasion simply because of some of the characters who opposed it. I was equally disdainful, however, of authoritarian conservatives who were all too gung ho for retaliation against the “bad other.” Too, many people, it seemed to me, were embracing positions and simply rationalizing those positions to justify the expression of their own base tribalistic impulses. Rationalization is part of human nature. I don’t see any point in debate with people when this is where they are coming from. They don’t know it is where they are coming from and they are data immune when they are coming from such a place. But for those open to dealing with the data, I know that almost everyone believed that Saddam had WMD. Although the administration essentially equated possession with use, possession is not the same as believing that Saddam would use WMD against the US or an ally, except perhaps defensively. And, in fact, he didn't do that when he had his best opportunity to do so in the first gulf war. And, if one thing was clear even before the invasion, it was that since the previous war, his WMD stocks were substantially degraded. If the risk of retaliation was apparently too great for him to use these weapons in the first gulf war even when he was under attack, it seemed mistaken to believe that he would place his fate at risk by getting behind a WMD attack on the US or Israel that would surely be followed by his annihilation. Though clearly not in the majority, there were some liberals and some conservatives who shared this view in common. I believe we were correct. And, to some of us, the plan to transform the Middle East via a democratic domino-effect seemed ultimately flawed because few Arabs are interested in their own freedom. Widespread [accepted] corruption coupled with a moral culture of tribal and clan loyalty trumps any aspiration for individual liberty in the primitive cultures that dominate the region. If there is some evidence of a desire for freedom (other than, perhaps, in Iran) I’d be interested in hearing about it. At the core, human beings tend to be conflicted about freedom and restraint. In many cultures, control and restraint are managed in deeply pathological ways. I believe this is very much the case in Arab culture and in cultures historically influenced by that culture. Personally, I know more than a little bit about the Southern Italian and Sicilian culture of my recent ancestors – a culture that was heavily influenced by the Moors. There is another side to the hospitable, family-oriented Sicilian culture that is not pretty. Indeed, much if not all of what the author of the article described is found in that culture and is quite familiar to me. But, while the culture of the region is associated with a different way of thinking, we shouldn’t conclude that we are incapable of understanding anything about the way people in the region think. And in the case of Saddam specifically, we were dealing with a full-on psychopath whose grandiosity and lust for power may have been boundless, but his visions for his own grandiose legacy were narcissistically expansive and romantic rather than apocalyptic. He showed no evidence of a wish to have Iraq annihilated by the US in retaliation for a WMD attack on Israel or the US. And, conducting an invasion that seemed doomed to failure on the small chance that Saddam “might” do something to hurt us, or alternatively, conquering Iraq with a reign of terror followed by the installation of another tyrant, were paths too far removed from what I, as a Christian, could support in good conscience. This has nothing to do with Cheney and Rumsfeld. Please understand not all the world cares about US politics. Stop trying to change the subject. The point is these people are backward and not at all like us. Cheney/Rumsfeld/Bush/Clinton (sorry thats all I can think of) and all your other idiot politicians mean basically nothing to the rest of us. This post is about the ME, not oyu and your political bullshit.
So, are you saying we shouldn't have taken Saddam at his word? In spite of his history? That we should have ignored that fact that he had invaded another country AS HE SAID he would, and was in possession of WMDs, which he had used in a genocidal way before, and, lastly, we should have ignored the fact that by disallowing complete inspections of his weapons systems -- which was a condition of the armistice of the first Gulf War (and THE ACTUAL REASON WE WENT INTO IRAQ, which the media has effectively obfuscated by shouting WMD! WMD!)? Don't you realize that if the idiot didn't have WMDs, and had simply let the weapons inspections continue, he would be alive today and happily torturing and killing his fellow countrymen and women. We went in because Saddam was an egomaniacal dictator who let his typical Arab bragging write a check his ass couldn't cash.
In short, I guess you're saying Saddam was just another blow-hard dictator who we should have ignored, like Hitler, Stalin, Mao . . . etc. etc. etc. Now, just go listen to your IPOD, watch your MTV, get your news from CNN, and vote for the peace candidate of your choice. After all, this is a safe friendly world, and there is nothing polite diplomacy can't resolve. The Arabs just want to be our friends. All that talk about destorying the West is just a harmless form of Arab rehetoric, and we shouldn't hate them because of a slight cultural mispercetpions on things like 9-11, beheadings and suicide bombings. Please keep in mind where saddam got his chemical wepons (rumsfeld- usa) and got tacit approval to use them from us.
All good points, and well-taken.
The piece wasn't about Iraq, though - just about Arab thinking in general. One thought, though. How can you give patholological labels to people from a culture in which, for example, brutal leadership is the norm? So you're saying that "civilized noms" recognosed since the Enlightenment are really just relative things.
I mean 9-11 was just Islamic free expression, right? We have wars to clarify whose "norms " will be the ones we all acknowledge as superior. If we could agree on them before wars occur there would be no need for war. That is not how history has worked, like since forever. So we have wars. In war the idea is to win at all costs. Unconditional surrender. Anything less and you have capitulated to those whom you warred against and are in essence saying, "OK we'll allow you to live,grow, and remain a problem another generation will have to deal with in the same manner. This is especially true in the case of Islam which cannot be incorporated into enlightened western thought as the twelve points illuminated above so clearly point out. Kill'em..kill'em until their numbers are insignificant to the world and kill them until their civilization is only something cultural anthropologists study. They are trying to do no less to us. I think the 20th century has proven that past sworn enemies can be close friends and allies later. This doesn't take away from the laws of war. Sometimes co-existing in peace is not an option. When it comes to war, we must move quickly and decisively to crush the enemy's will to resist. But we don't need to annhiliate Arab culture (nor will we, realistically) to move past this stage of war.
Not all Arabs are opposed to us, or at least many Arabs are more opposed to al-Qaeda than they are to us. This is especially true of many Gulf-state governments. We would be wise to differentiate between Arabs (and other Muslims) who are implacable enemies, and Arabs who are relatively pro-U.S. Contrary to Bush theology, it's definitely not "for us or against us." We would be wise to ally ourselves appropriately with those who are "kind of" for us, e.g. the Iraqi Sunnis in Anbar. Finally, I would point out that while in all honesty, modern day Arab culture is rather pathetic, Arab culture in the past was a beacon of advancement and perhaps the most advanced culture in the world (as the author points out). I do not think their culture is hopeless. They are quite backward, superstitious and foolish. But they can grow and improve. And let us not forget that we can devolve, just as they did, if we forget our own principles and values (e.g. torturing captives). I am deathly afraid that Islam will conquer us from the womb.We have to fight this war to win ,as if our lives depended on it ;witch it does.No hesitation ,no remorse ,and above all no regret. It means alot of dead people, we have the capability.I dont think we have the will!!!
I have never been afraid of an Arab for one second in my entire life, yet I'm suppossed to devote my life to fighting a war with them bc they are such a massive threat? Get a life.
Matt I'll get a life,if you'll get caught up reading your world history.
One of the mandatory works for understanding Arab culture is de Atkine's Why Arabs Lose Wars ( http://www.unc.edu/depts/diplomat/AD_Issues/amdipl_17/articles/deatkine_arabs1.html ). The telling thing about military affairs is that the military culture tends to reflect the overall culture from which it comes. Cultures which factionalize its armed forces because they are not trusted to integrate, generally come from societies in which, yes, factions are played against each other. 'Combined Arms' as a concept is almost unknown in the Arab world as it would require allowing different armed forces to regularly train together to operate effectively. In such cultures rank comes from social status or from direct payment for rank Cultures which place low value on its citizens will treat conscripts and draftees poorly. Almost without exception in Arab cultures, that is the case, in which Officers are more than just priveleged, they treat the regular soldiers as sub-human. All incentive to foster initiative is replaced with a highly controlled system of 'who does what' that trying to do anything, like on-the-spot repairs by those in a combat role, is punished, not rewarded. Any society which has these characteristics would tend not to treat human rights as something of value, that ethnic and other discriminators are more important than capability or ability, and that adherance to those in command of the government. Such governments tend to create multiple divisions within society so as to create distrust amongst those factions by a system of dramatic rewards and punishments. By doing that and switching who gets rewarded and punished on various outlooks, an atmosphere of conspiracy is generated as, surely, someone had to be behind a seemingly random punishment or reward... instead of it being random. Those are not anything close to modern views of society or culture as the West understands it. These come from partially amalgamated tribal cultures that have multiple social, ethnic and religious affiliations within their tribes. Arab governments, by and large, have used those divisions, added in extras, and then have tired to use not only Nationalism but 'Pan-Arab' concepts that have fallen flat on their faces due to the multiple divisions keeping anyone from doing anything in a united manner. Thus it must be a '*conspiracy*' stopping it from happening! Yes! A conspiracy of power-hungry individuals and groups keeping everyone at each other's throats so that they can survive in power! Do that in a blatant and obvious fashion and no one will believe it is happening, because no one would do such daft things on their own if they were the least bit civilized... Yes, that is a cultural judgement! Civilization has a meaning to it, and getting folks organized to common goals and ends in a unifying fashion is highly civilized. When you start to do things to reward yourself at the cost of society, nations and individuals, that is uncivilized. And when organizations start to wage personal and predatory war to bring all Nations down so that they may rule and exploit the chaos they have caused, they are waging predatory warfare. Internationalism hasn't found a way to deal with that while the old fashioned law of nations *does*. I really and for true do not care if folks wind up with a horrific government over them, because they are not smart nor w |
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I liked this better the first time I read it, when it was called The America I Have Seen by Sayyid Qutb....
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While I'm not completely sure when it was written, this essay on just how different Arabs, and specifically Saudis, are is still quite interesting. While I think he may be overgeneralizing at least a little bit, this does track...
Tracked: Sep 04, 15:01
Is America losing its work ethic? Am ThinkerWhy I quit teaching. PajamasSurrender. How societies commit suicide. Dalrymple in City Journal. I missed that one.Stuff like this keeps happening.One nation, under therapy. SC&A on ambulance-chasing trauma c
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It was interesting to see the various major linkers to that controversial piece on Multiculturalism and Arabs we posted the other day because I had only been vaguely aware of one of the sites, and unaware of the others. The most productive of blog visitor
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