Maggie's FarmWe are a commune of inquiring, skeptical, politically centrist, capitalist, anglophile, traditionalist New England Yankee humans, humanoids, and animals with many interests beyond and above politics. Each of us has had a high-school education (or GED), but all had ADD so didn't pay attention very well, especially the dogs. Each one of us does "try my best to be just like I am," and none of us enjoys working for others, including for Maggie, from whom we receive neither a nickel nor a dime. Freedom from nags, cranks, government, do-gooders, control-freaks and idiots is all that we ask for. |
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Monday, July 5. 2021Monday morning linksAmerica's July 4 begins as Joey 'Jaws' Chestnut sets new world record at Nathan's Hot Dog Eating Contest at Coney Island by downing 76 franks in 10 minutes in front of 5,000 screaming fans Related? Chinese Scientists Produce Genetically Modified Pigs for Human Transplant Young Americans need to appreciate the good fortune they take for granted Our American Inheritance - We must not forget our forebears’ sacrifices. The Left’s War on Gifted Kids. Local progressive activists have found a cause even more unpopular than "Defund the police," and are pushing it with even greater vigor. The Real Problem With Critical Race Theory NEA Goes All-In on Critical Race Theory Hate in America's Classrooms Has there ever been a nation in history with more opportunities for Black people than the USA? Rep. James Clyburn outright lies about Voter I.D. Chicago Mayor Lori Lightfoot Blames Trump For Surge In Violent Crime Chicago Mayor Lightfoot Says 99% Of The Criticism She Receives Is Because She Is A Black Woman…Nothing to do with her trainwreck policies. Trump Says One Of His Greatest Accomplishments Was Exposing The ‘Fake News Media’ China’s deal with Montenegro makes sense if you realize it’s not about money Saudi Arabia moves towards the Gulf peace train with Israel Trackbacks
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"China doesn’t want money; it wants land – in Africa, Europe, Asia, and Latin America."
I suspect the incoming Chinese colonizers will make those Dutch settlers look like Mother Teresa in comparison. Re: NEA Goes All-In on Critical Race Theory Hate in America's Classrooms
The response is not positive as student enrollment in public schools dropped by 1.5M. https://justthenews.com/nation/states/public-school-enrollment-drops-3-percent-nationally Opportunities for blacks: some people don't know when they are are well-off, or in today's environment, don't want to know.
QUOTE: H.P. Smith: Has there ever been a nation in history with more opportunities for Black people than the USA? H.P. Smith, 1910: Has there ever been a nation in history with more opportunities for Black people than the USA? H.P. Smith, 1950: Has there ever been a nation in history with more opportunities for Black people than the USA? You are exactly correct - and since blacks in America are no more free today than they were in 1851, I say we just go ahead and re-institute slavery. It's not like blacks are going to notice any difference, right?
Jerryskids: You are exactly correct - and since blacks in America are no more free today than they were in 1851, I say we just go ahead and re-institute slavery.
Of course that's false. Rather, even though Blacks were freer in 1910 than in 1850, that doesn't mean that they should abandon the struggle for civil liberties. And just because Blacks were freer in 1950 than in 1910 doesn't mean they should abandon the struggle for civil liberties. So, pointing out that Blacks have greater freedoms than before is not a valid argument for abandoning the struggle for civil liberties today. Aggie: What civil liberties are under struggle?
That would be a more appropriate argument, rather than things were great in 1910 1950. Indeed, it was a common argument in 1850 that Blacks were better off as slaves in America. Even if it were true, it's not a good argument against emancipation. As for today, systemic racism is still a problem. The better argument is the best way to approach the problem.
#4.1.1.1.1
Zachriel
on
2021-07-05 13:06
(Reply)
What is still systemically racist?
#4.1.1.1.1.1
indyjonesouthere
on
2021-07-05 13:16
(Reply)
Here's a few examples:
• The old boy network: While it is natural and reasonable to hire those you know, and people recommended by trusted friends and colleagues, when a society has a history of racism, this leads to continued racial disparities — even if no one is racist. If a few still have racial views, the racial disparities can continue for generations. • First past the post elections combined with gerrymandering: First past the post dilutes minority votes. Gerrymandering exacerbates the dilution. • Blacks receive harsher penalties for the same crimes as Whites. Blacks have lower starting capital in life, at least in part due to past discrimination. People with ethnic Black names are less likely to receive a callback on job applications. And for something more up-to-date: facial recognition software results in more false criminal positives for Black faces than for White faces. (There’s an interesting side-story about this: https://petapixel.com/2015/09/19/heres-a-look-at-how-color-film-was-originally-biased-toward-white-people/ )
#4.1.1.1.1.1.1
Zachriel
on
2021-07-05 13:27
(Reply)
The old boy network operates within every race. The black caucus is an old boy network along with the democratic socialists. You can complain that the black caucus is small but that is what a minority lives with.
Gerrymandering has been costly to white democrats but beneficial to black democrats. Of course you will complain that only whites and especially republican whites gerrymander. Equity justice as promoted by Obama mandates the opposite of harsh penalties for blacks. Equity justice shows up as laws being ignored so that fewer blacks face the justice system. BLM is a perfect example of a blind eye to law being allowed in blue cities vs the DC Jan 6 riots.
#4.1.1.1.1.1.1.1
indyjonesouthere
on
2021-07-05 14:11
(Reply)
indyjonesouthere: The old boy network operates within every race.
As noted, again, it's natural and reasonable to look for referrals from people you know and trust. The problem occurs in a society with a history of racism. The old boy network tends to perpetuate racial disparities. That's called systemic racism. indyjonesouthere: Of course you will complain that only whites and especially republican whites gerrymander. Entrenched powers tend to use the power that they have to perpetuate their power. When that power has a basis in historical racism, it's called systemic racism. That answers your question above.
#4.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1
Zachriel
on
2021-07-05 14:21
(Reply)
The most gross systemic racism we have is quotas, better know as affirmative action. Every blue city practices that kind of systemic racism and Atlanta is a perfect example.
The entrenched powers since FDR and LBJ are of the democratic party controlling the SCOTUS nominations for which they could mandate law rather than review law. Small wonder they are in a panic over the current recent change of the court.
#4.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1
indyjonesouthere
on
2021-07-05 15:09
(Reply)
indyjonesouthere: The most gross systemic racism we have is quotas, better know as affirmative action.
Affirmative action is one response to systemic racism, the existence of which you have apparently granted by sidestepping our previous comment.
#4.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1
Zachriel
on
2021-07-05 15:15
(Reply)
There is nothing to sidestep. Systemic racism is a creation of the true believers that followed and expanded critical theory. Gramsci and Marcuse developed the race part of critical theory because the class angle wasn't cutting it with Americans. The Frankfort school found a pleasant acceptance in academia and it traveled across the country. The current good old boys club resides in academia and is spreading out into K-12 schools. Even the fictional 1619 project author is getting tenure at North Carolina. Just more good old boy fraternizing and payola for the mediocre. At a time when we need more STEM degrees in order to compete we are getting nothing more than "studies" degrees which can only function in government bureaucracies in which we need less government and more productivity.
#4.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1
indyjonesouthere
on
2021-07-05 16:08
(Reply)
indyjonesouthere: Systemic racism is a creation of the true believers
Ignoring our position doesn't make it go away. We provide examples of systemic racism, including the old boy network. Consider a racially segregated society where Whites hold the power and the jobs. One day, segregation ends. Of course, on that day Whites will still hold the power and the jobs. You might think the racial disparities will quickly disappear. But consider a store owner, one without racial bigotry, who needs to hire a new clerk. He talks to his White friends at his White country club. His White neighbors refer him to a son of one of the members of his White church. This is an example systemic racism. The store owner isn't bigoted, it's just that his social network is almost all White, a vestige of the history of racism in his society.
#4.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1
Zachriel
on
2021-07-05 16:48
(Reply)
The only systemic racism is in academia and it has been in the academic social "sciences" for decades. It is a cancer that needs to be removed even if the social sciences are removed from the university. Hillsdale college would not accept mandates from the government and were made ineligible for student loans. This same principle needs to be used to kill off Marxist theory in the university, the real good old boys club. Race based employment exists in government and academia and it is mandated by socialist marxist politicians in both institutions.
#4.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1
indyjonesouthere
on
2021-07-05 17:29
(Reply)
indyjonesoithere The only systemic racism is in academia … [/i]
Are you arguing that a segregated society where Whites held the power never existed? You have again refused to engage the specifics we provided. Let us know when you have a substantive response.
#4.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1
Zachriel
on
2021-07-05 20:43
(Reply)
If whites outnumber any other race they will acquire more power...if that surprises you simply look at South Africa. Now if you have a choice of which country to live in then I suggest that only the uneducated would find South Africa culture more inclusive. Not even the black tribes can get along. Once again you are simply parroting Marxist critical theory that is so loved by academia. There is a reason that people break down the doors to get into this country and it sure isn't racism. It is a shame that academia can not accept the choices non Americans make to get into this country. If the black citizens in this country want to vastly improve life for blacks they would do something about the 70% out of wedlock births and a failure of fatherhood in their culture.
#4.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1
indyjonesouthere
on
2021-07-05 21:29
(Reply)
Yes, I didn't think you could bring yourself to answer that question.
Referencing your obfuscations below: Have you ever seen an 'old boy' network in different cultures? Non-white ones? I have. That's not a racial feature that you can arbitrarily assign to whites - it's more a feature of same-sex social groups anywhere, isn't it, male and female, exclusive of race. That's my experience. They can be nurturing or exclusive in nature - they're call 'cliques' - right? But you're only crediting existence to white male versions. Likewise gerrymandering, as if both parties don't cynically manipulate geography to win elections. Likewise the tired arguments about how racially unfair the justice system is. There's simply too much data out there that refutes these points with clarity now. Are you OK? These examples are really not up to standard. You need to develop more cogent and up-to-date arguments.
#4.1.1.1.1.2
Aggie
on
2021-07-05 13:45
(Reply)
Aggie: Have you ever seen an 'old boy' network in different cultures? Non-white ones?
As pointed out, the old boy network is natural and reasonable, but it tends to entrench existing power structures, even when there is no conscious effort to do so. When there is bias, then it can perpetuate disparities for generations. When it has a racial basis, then it constitutes systemic racism, which answers indyjonesouthere's question. Aggie: Likewise gerrymandering, as if both parties don't cynically manipulate geography to win elections. Even without gerrymandering, first past the post voting dilutes minority votes. Consider a region with a history of racism and a 70% White population. Even without any conscious effort, the politics will generally reflect the concerns of the White population, which will also tend to institute changes that favor their continued political power. And that's assuming universal good will of those in power.
#4.1.1.1.1.2.1
Zachriel
on
2021-07-05 13:53
(Reply)
1931: Al Capone cheats on his taxes and goes to prison.
1993: Al Sharpton cheats on his taxes and goes to the White House. B. Hammer: 1931: Al Capone cheats on his taxes and goes to prison.
Al Capone kept two sets of books, and testimony showed that he intentionally hid income from the IRS. He was found guilty and died in prison. Capone was also implicated in a murderous reign in the underworld. B. Hammer: 1993: Al Sharpton cheats on his taxes and goes to the White House. Al Sharpton was acquitted of state tax fraud, but pleaded guilty to not filing a required state return. He was delinquent on his taxes, but has since paid most of it back. Re: Capone was also implicated in a murderous reign in the underworld.
Should we talk about Al Sharpton and the Tamara Brawley case? Everything has worked out pretty good for the race hustler. How many lives has he ruined? How many innocents have died because of his lies? Race hustlers are no better than the Al Capones of the world. B. Hammer: Not surprisingly, that went right over your head.
You diverted by comparing Al Capone with Al Sharpton. We showed why the comparison is without merit. B. Hammer: Should we talk about Al Sharpton and the Tamara Brawley case? No, because it is not relevant to H.P. Smith's fallacious argument.
#4.2.1.2.1
Zachriel
on
2021-07-05 13:09
(Reply)
Still went over your head.
#4.2.1.2.1.1
B. Hammer
on
2021-07-05 13:17
(Reply)
1828: There has never been a party that tried harder to squelch opportunities for black people than the Democrat party. (founding)
1860: There has never been a party that tried harder to squelch opportunities for black people than the Democrat party. (opposition to Lincoln, fighting the Civil War) 1865: There has never been a party that tried harder to squelch opportunities for black people than the Democrat party. (founding the KKK) 1865: There has never been a party that tried harder to squelch opportunities for black people than the Democrat party. (President Andrew Johnson, Democrat, vetoes the Civil Rights Act of 1865) 1877: There has never been a party that tried harder to squelch opportunities for black people than the Democrat party. (end of Reconstruction) 1915: There has never been a party that tried harder to squelch opportunities for black people than the Democrat party. (founding of "2nd Klan") 1915: There has never been a party that tried harder to squelch opportunities for black people than the Democrat party. (Woodrow Wilson, progressive Democrat, screens Birth of a Nation in the White House with his family, cabinet, and director D. W. Griffith) 1957L There has never been a party that tried harder to squelch opportunities for black people than the Democrat party. (filibustered by Democrat Strom Thurmond) 1964: There has never been a party that tried harder to squelch opportunities for black people than the Democrat party. (filibustered by Democrat Robert Byrd) Throughout their history, Democrats have argued that blacks are inferior to whites. In the past, it was an argument against their equal rights. In the present it is either to give them special "rights" (i.e. affirmative action), teach them they leftist white people to "help" them, or to fight voting integrity laws. Rather than show how blacks can and have succeeded - even in the most racist times in our history, criminal blacks (often armed) who are killed in interactions with police are martyred by Democrats. Democrats fight opportunities for black parents to send their kids to the school of their choice requiring them to attend dysfunctional schools further limiting their opportunities. The Democrat party hasn't really changed in their attitude towards blacks; only their tactics have. mudbug: 1828: There has never been a party that tried harder to squelch opportunities for black people than the Democrat party.
Quite so. mudbug: The Democrat party hasn't really changed in their attitude towards blacks; only their tactics have. As minorities, including the vast majority of Black citizens, largely comprise the Democratic Party, that would be a fallacious conclusion. You must have missed something in your recounting of history. That there are a lot of blacks in the Democrat party is immaterial. Black people can be fooled just like white people. Reread the two paragraphs prior to the sentence you quoted. That's only some of what Democrats do to blacks.
Here's another: black conservatives are called every racist name in the book by white (and black) Democrats - you know, the party that is supposed to love blacks. Independence of thought is not encouraged, it is condemned and ridiculed. mudbug: That there are a lot of blacks in the Democrat party is immaterial.
Of course it's material, but perhaps not determinate. mudbug: Black people can be fooled just like white people. Sure. But your argument would depend on the vast majority of the Black community not having political volition over generations. It would be a much more parsimonious explanation that Blacks generally vote Democratic because they see the Democratics Party as the better of the two major parties. mudbug: Here's another: black conservatives are called every racist name in the book by white (and black) Democrats - you know, the party that is supposed to love blacks. Ignoring your really strange construction, there's a long history of political debate in the Black community on how best to approach the problem of racial inequality. Some people call names.
#4.3.1.1.1
Zachriel
on
2021-07-05 14:32
(Reply)
Zachriel: Sure. But your argument would depend on the vast majority of the Black community not having political volition over generations. It would be a much more parsimonious explanation that Blacks generally vote Democratic because they see the Democratics Party as the better of the two major parties.
Ignoring your strange spelling of "Democratic" as well as your choice of words, do the blacks in inner cities (i.e. Baltimore, Detroit, Philadelphia, and South Chicago) vote for Democrats for 50 years because they have more opportunity or because their standard of living is increasing?
#4.3.1.1.1.1
mudbug
on
2021-07-05 15:01
(Reply)
mudbug: do the blacks in inner cities (i.e. Baltimore, Detroit, Philadelphia, and South Chicago) vote for Democrats for 50 years because they have more opportunity or because their standard of living is increasing?
As noted, Blacks generally vote Democratic because they see the Democratic Party as the better of the two major parties. More particularly, national concerns are superseding. Blacks have a larger influence on the national agenda through cohesion within the more friendly environment of the Democratic Party, while Republican actions have repeatedly repelled all but the most conservative of Blacks.
#4.3.1.1.1.1.1
Zachriel
on
2021-07-05 15:11
(Reply)
So what you're saying is that they see past the destruction of their neighborhoods, crime, and lack of opportunity that they live in every day when they vote for mayor or governor because of some "national concerns?"
Since you see that as reasonable, would you continue to vote for the same party for decades that keeps promising more opportunities and to make your life better but instead your opportunities dwindle and your life gets worse? How many times would you do that? Isn't that Hillary Clintons definition of insanity?
#4.3.1.1.1.1.1.1
mudbug
on
2021-07-05 15:29
(Reply)
mudbug: Since you see that as reasonable, would you continue to vote for the same party for decades that keeps promising more opportunities and to make your life better but instead your opportunities dwindle and your life gets worse?
Most Blacks acknowledge the great strides that have been made (e.g. Juneteenth was just made a national holiday), but believe the system is still largely stacked against them. Furthermore, most Blacks believe that Republicans would make things worse. mudbug: Isn't that Hillary Clintons definition of insanity? When you insist rational Blacks would vote Republican, but they don't and haven't for generations, and you are thereby forced to conclude that they are insane, then that should be sufficient to trigger cognitive dissonance in your mind. You need to rethink your underlying beliefs.
#4.3.1.1.1.1.1.1.1
Zachriel
on
2021-07-05 15:40
(Reply)
I am a Black man and a civil engineer. I grew up in south central Los Angeles and made a good life for myself and my children because I didn't buy into your kind of bullshit race identity victimization. I worked my ass off in the Army and then later in the private sector. I owe white guilt liberals like you absolutely nothing.
Blakey: I am a Black man and a civil engineer.
That was a common divergence of opinion in the past, as well. Many Blacks did not march with King and his predecessors, and rejected his methods. Was it better to fight for political change, or better to simply work hard and try to get ahead, to prove yourself. History has shown that both approaches have value, but that without political pressure, civil rights would never have advanced. Blakey: I worked my ass off in the Army ... The Army was integrated in 1948. The argument against integration was that it would hurt morale and recruitment and distract from the military mission. Before that political change, opportunities for Blacks in the military were limited no matter how hard you worked. @Blakey - Thank you for pushing back on this stupidity — and thank you for your service. You are exactly right, you do owe absolutely nothing to white guilt liberals, who are by far are the worst thing about America, full stop.
The best thing that could happen to gifted kids would be to get kicked out of woke school. Bonus if their families could stop paying school taxes.
Related? Chinese Scientists Produce Genetically Modified Pigs for Human Transplant: So now, a man could say he's partly a "pig"???
The Left’s War on Gifted Kids. Local progressive activists have found a cause even more unpopular than "Defund the police," and are pushing it with even greater vigor. The Left = HATE. The Real Problem With Critical Race Theory: It's lies from top to bottom of the cesspool. Chicago Mayor Lori Lightfoot Blames Trump For Surge In Violent Crime: It's Chi-town, woman; Chi-town IS CRIME. Trump Says One Of His Greatest Accomplishments Was Exposing The ‘Fake News Media’: Which is why I don't read major "news" outlets, or listen to or watch them. China’s deal with Montenegro makes sense if you realize it’s not about money: And NPR said... Well, I don't trust NPR , and won't listen to it. Saudi Arabia moves towards the Gulf peace train with Israel: They've wised up. The problem with CRT is that it's another means used by the progressive left to keep blacks in slavery...to the government that keeps it in the chains of self-destruction.
Do they use special low-fat, low-sodium hot dogs in that hot dog eating contest? Because I have to believe that that many regular hot dogs has to contain a near-lethal amount of fat and sodium.
Oh, Pooh. Don’t believe everything you read about fat and salt.
Quite right Texan99.
Jerry skids does raise an interesting point. What are these hotdogs made of? Are they standard Nathan's fare or are they a smaller, lighter variant? Anyway, my congrats to the winner. It's an amazing gastronomical feat no matter what he is shoving down his throat. Hooray for gluttony. I don't know how much longer old Joey can keep it up though. He was looking pretty peaked at the end of it, and you could see him really struggling to keep it down, and trying to not taste the bits still in his mouth as they brought the winner's belt on stage for him.
Wherever they're from must have opened back up and now they feel safe getting on the internet without so much fear of getting a virus. But they're probably still double-masked in deference to Herr Doktor Fauci.
48 comments—you can always tell who’s shown up when that happens.
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