Maggie's Farm

For what it's worth, my two boys work, but getting a job has nothing to do with illegal immigrants "taking" jobs.

When they found jobs, and were younger, they had to get paperwork from the school - working papers. I had my first job at 13, and I didn't need working papers. Of course, I also did babysitting, mowed lawns and did odd jobs. In my suburb, all these jobs have been taken by entrepreneurs. All lawn and odd job work is handled by professional crews (who may or may not hire illegals, I don't really care or pay attention since I cut my own lawn). Babysitting is still a teen thing, though young people have banded together at the YMCA to set up a 'cooperative' to manage it.

More to the point, though, the BIGGEST problem with teens and finding jobs is the minimum wage. While I know many people "like" the minimum wage because it "helps" people - it does nothing of the sort.

Very few head of households earn minimum wage.

All the minimum wage does is make it difficult for business owners to hire untested, inexperienced, and seasonal workers. If I can hire a teen at $6.00 an hour for the summer, versus having to pay $7.50 an hour due to law, I'm going to hire someone I can train and keep on for longer. The cost of getting someone up to speed, in most jobs, is incredibly expensive and difficult.

Teens are shut out not because of illegals, but because of a variety of reasons - some regional in nature, most not.
In my area, many are coddled (my sons work, they have friends who do not).

Others will not do manual labor (my sons still mow the lawn and weed the garden with me, and do some minor carpentry work when I do DIY stuff), they want 'real' jobs or easier jobs. My boys have both worked maintenance at the local pool, not an easy job compared to the lifeguards who get regular breaks, and get their jobs because their parents' know the Board.

Minimum wage locks them out of some positions. My boys tried to get jobs at a new store opening in town, but they only hired adults, because they couldn't afford to pay for school-age seasonal workers.

Many jobs have been automated. Cost of paying for some positions is expensive. Where I grew up, teens could earn cash as crossing guards during the school year. Today, they have lights in place, it's cheaper. I notice my local Burger King and McDonald's have automated ordering now, too - and very few teens working there (a side effect of the minimum wage).

It's interesting to think of teens and the issues of finding jobs as "lost to illegals" - I'm sure there are instances of this, but I don't think it's common. In fact, I'd say it's very uncommon in most areas.

No, my state does not have a stupidly high minimum wage, only the federal minimum.

Yet, nationwide, the teen employment rate is at lows, including my state.

Yes, many of the jobs you mention feature teens here, too. But by and large teens are being priced out of jobs across the nation because of the minimum wage. It's a simple fact, you can't raise wages by fiat without having detrimental effects.

We're seeing this in states where, as you point out, they have raised it 'too far'. But we're seeing it in states where it exists as a federal minimum. Take a look at teen rates of employment from the 60's onward and you'll see it dropping.

http://thelibertarianrepublic.com/chipotle-responds-to-14-minimum-wage-increase-with-14-higher-prices/

Here's the bottom line - minimum wages do not help anyone except the lucky few who keep their jobs. Even then, as the above article shows, it may not help them because either prices go up, or jobs get cut, or some combination of both.

The difficult part is that empirical evidence is hard to come by - but for a reason that is often overlooked. The increases in the wage have often been small. It's like tossing a pebble in the pool. You know the water level rose with the introduction of the pebble - you just can't tell by how much. It's imperceptible. But it did, and you know it did.

The problems of teen employment have its roots outside of immigration. For many years, out in the east end of Long Island (without much of a teen population back then) businesses used to bring in Europeans for the summer. I remember visiting the Hamptons and Montauk and being served by Irish, German and British college kids. Back then, the shortage of labor resources and heavy tourist traffic made shipping in foreign workers for the summer worthwhile. Now that the East End is more heavily populated (and there are barely any illegals, comparatively), this is far less common. Yet teens struggle to find work. Why? Because the businesses out there can't afford to hire untried seasonal workers in large numbers.
In 1982, my best friend and 2 other fellows worked as busboys one summer in Southampton. They made enough to pay their rent, buy bikes and surfboards, pay for gas, and come back to college with enough money for 2 semesters. You can still do that today. IF you can find the jobs.

Regardless of where I am, I always feel like I'm in the U.S.

I've worked for a Spanish-language company and spent tons of time in Miami. It's basically the 'capital' of Latin America - but I loved it. I had to travel to many of our offices, particularly in border cities. I'm familiar with the issues in those areas (my step- sister is married to a lawyer who is Mexican, now a U.S. citizen and living in a border town). While she is a Progressive, we get along great, though she clearly has misguided notions about what we're giving away. Either way, it's fun visiting those areas and I miss that job (oddly, I'm no longer with that company because 2 white Americans moved into management and ruined it. The naturalized citizens who ran it were much more in tune with the business. Maybe that's why I'm a bit more forgiving...)

I have no stomach for tatted-up creeps, but to each their own. Most people are doing that today, so it's hard to avoid. Still, I've worked with Hindus from India, Chinese from Hong Kong, Mexicans, Cubans, Brazilians and Argentinians (some legal, in my corporate jobs, others not so much - all were terrific).

I don't know what American culture and values are, to be honest. They tend to vary from place to place. The one thing that seems pretty common, though, is that if you work hard and are willing to put yourself out there, you'll succeed regardless of who you are. To me, that's America.

I wish we could accept that, but some people simply can't handle change. My whole life has been about change, so I've stopped worrying about it.

I agree with you on all points. But I consider that a different discussion. That discussion, to me, is about giveaways at every level, which we have far too much of.

Immigration is a completely separate issue, though because the giveaways are directed to illegals now, it has become inextricably combined. Which doesn't mean they can't be unwound - it just requires political will. That, however, means having a backbone.