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Friday, October 9. 2015
My father in law wants to give me his .38 Colt Detective Special. I'd be happy to have it. He carried it for many years, and it slept in his bedside table at night. Just one of many reasons to respect his daughter.
It's a safe firearm to carry fully loaded.
I have plenty of long guns and I have a CC permit, but figuring out how to legally accept and register a handgun gift from a family member from one state to a blue New England state was not easy to figure out until I reached the right person.
All he has to do is to bring the gun to his local dealer. That dealer will mail it to my local gun shop, where it gets re-registered to me. Simple enough. Main thing to remember, once you have possession, is not to transport the handgun out of state unless there is reciprocity.
I have a place quite near by where people can play with handguns. Not being a handgun afficionado, a simple revolver instead of a 9 mm is all I want or need. For home defense, I still think the Taurus that fires shotgun shells might be best. However, I can hit close targets with handguns.
When we were kids, we had a loaded .22 revolver in the kitchen drawer and a loaded 12 ga. leaning against the kitchen entry. Not paranoid at all - just country ways. Shooting beer bottles off of stumps was the main handgun violence. Difficult to hit them - easier with a snowball.
I taught all of my kids - and Mrs. BD - firearm handling and firearm safety. Learned it from my sportsman gramps and my ex-Army Dad. Hope to pass it on to grandkids, God willing.
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Revolvers are very good defense guns because they are simple and most don't have safeties to deal with in a stressful situation.
So your handguns are registered to you?! Yikes! I suspect the transfer is actually so you would go through a NICS check rather than a registration.
Doubt it. My CC permit already had a full-life colonoscopy.
Actually, the main thing to remember is that history proves;
Gun registration precedes gun confiscation and
Gun confiscation precedes mass murder.
overpenetration is the usual worry with pistol loads. I believe most home defense experts recommend shotguns.
Several ammo companies make critical defense and other upclose rounds that won't over penetrate. a little youtube search will find many reviews. I have a little S&W model 36 with Hornady critical defense rounds in it.
That Colt looks like a nice revolver, fits nice in your pocket.
They also make ratshot for them when your walking your property, but hard to find.
More bear $h!t from Donny Boy. How 'bout a source for your statement?
If you use the right load (hollow point), penetration shouldn't be a problem. The problem with a shotgun is twofold (1) scatter which leads to pellets hitting things other than your target, i.e. your family, and (2) manipulating it in close quarters. Outside a home, you can point a shotgun. Inside a home, you need to AIM a shotgun to avoid hitting people you don't want to hit. This takes two hands and a check to gun weld. Not easy to do inside when you're opening doors, rounding corners, etc.
If you need a shotgun because you're not accurate enough to reliably hit your target with a pistol, you probably don't have enough training/experience/practice to engage a criminal in your house intent on doing you harm. Might as well just fire a shot (blanks) in the air early on and hope the idiot leaves.
My own weapon of choice is a 357 revolver (I won't argue with anyone who favors a 45). I've learned to use it in close combat situations and practice with it weekly. I can assemble and disassemble the thing in the dark.
Whatever gun you choose, it's (1) less useful, and (2) possibly harmful if you don't learn how to use it in stressful, close quarter situations and keep up your practice.
PS - I also own a 12 ga and a 308 long gun if the bad boys are outside my house.
Just what the H did you do in the Navy, some admin job?
hi Mike. your Mom says hi. she'll be home on Monday.
Thanks, we heard you still like little boys so figure she's safe with you.
hey mike, what the deal with all the crying. how do you make her stop?
Surprisingly, the .223 round of most AR-15 rifles is a round that does not penetrate walls as well as handguns and shotguns. The round is designed to tumble and break up on impact so it loses a lot of its effectiveness. They all will penetrate 5 hollow-core drywall walls or 10 sheets of spaced 1/2 drywall and still have lethal velocity.
the .223 and its NATO equivalent are designed to rotate forward in medium as dense as human flesh, where they fragment at the cannelure (where the brass crimps into the bullet) and creates a big wound channel. I assume it would punch through drywall.
I shoot competitive trap, so my weapon of choice is an italian unsingle. I think obsession with home defense guns (tactical sling, tactical light, tactical heat shield, tactical laser, tactical ghost sights, tactical bayonet lug, tactical tactics) is mostly by people who don't actually shoot anything, although it obvious they do sleep with them.
A .223 will penetrate the steel plate of a bullet proof vest at 15 yds. I've seen it. If you (and anyone in the way) are lucky, the bullet will hit a stud and stop, but it could go through every dry wall sheet in my house and maybe the thin wood siding.
Whoever recommended firing a warning shot, just be prepared to lie under oath if necessary. Don't ever admit you fired a warning shot. Firing a warning shot can get you in more trouble than killing someone in self defense when you have a make-my-day law in your state.
Yes, the .223 has a very good initial penetration, but it breaks up and less mass penetrates multiple walls compared to 9mm or buckshot. There are Youtube videos of comparisons.
I believe the optimal home defense load was No. 4 buck, based on tests using that ballistic gel.
The issue isn't whether or not it will penetrate a wall. All of the rounds in question will penetrate the drywall used in homes. The question is weather it will be more likely to penetrate the body of the bad guy you shoot and then hit one of your family members.
Hollow point rounds have two advantages in a home defense situation and both are due to energy being dissipated in the tissues: (1) more damage is done to the intended target, and (2) there is a greater chance that the bullet fragments remain inside the body of the bad guy.
I want to incapacitate the bad guy as soon as possible and with as few shots as possible while limiting the chances that harm will come to my family members. Because it is well established that a single shot does not always immediately incapacitate a bad guy, I train two shots to torso and one shot to head and typically train with both a 357 mag revolver and 45 pistol.
If you are such a lousy shot that you will be hitting drywall instead of bad guy, the answer isn't a different gun or different ammo, it's more time on the pistol range.
Mailing, or handing a gun to a gun dealer to transfer to someone will work in any state where handgun possession is legal.
Some states a private transfer requires nothing other than the owner reasonably believe that the person he is handing the gun to is legally allowed to own a gun in that state.
As I've gotten older, I like revolvers more and more. If you pull the trigger of a loaded gun, and nothing happens, what do you do? You pull the trigger again. No safeties, no stove piping, no Jams, NFF. As soon as you pick any revolver, you know who it works.
Nothing wrong with a revolver, as long as you figure you only need to shoot one person--or you practice reloading the thing *religiously*.
That said, no, the Taurus Judge is not adequate for home defense. The .410 is an anemic round--buckshot only gets 6 or 7 inches of penetration in ballistic gel. The FBI standard is a minimum of 12 inches.
IMO the best "home defense" weapon would be something like the Mossberg SA 20 loaded with buckshot. The 20 is powerful enough to do the job but soft shooting enough that even a smaller woman can handle it. I'm going to be getting this one http://www.mossberg.com/product/sa-20-railed-75778/ in 2-3 weeks.
Currently I use a Glock 19 with a mounted light, but that's because I've extensively practiced with it.
Now, the best home defense is to move to a good neighborhood, have strong windows and doors, good locks, loyal and protective dogs and to keep things locked up. Maybe some well tended thorny bushes in front of the windows (keep them trimmed short enough that folks can't hide behind them, but tall enough to restrict access to the windows).
Then if they get in, the shotgun.
Of course if you insist on living in a place like Ferguson or Greece:
I use a Glock 19 for home defense. fifteen rounds capacity, easy to shoot and handle inside my home.
Over-penetration is not a concern, terminal energy is.
I've fired 357 magnum and 12 ga shotguns indoors and had ringing in my ear for days afterward.
The 9mm made the perp just as dead as the shotgun.
BTW so did my Ka-bar, not recommended for homeowners.
From Sept 1954 to Dec 1979, 254 officers died from wounds received in an armed encounter.
The shooting distance in 90% of those cases was less than 15 feet.
Contact to 3 feet ... 34%
3 feet to 6 feet ...... 47%
6 feet to 15 feet ..... 9%
The shooting distances where officers survived, remained almost the same during the SOP years (1970-1979), and for a random sampling of cases going back as far as 1929. 4,000 cases were reviewed.
The shooting distance in 75% of those cases was less than 20 feet.
Contact to 10 feet ... 51%
10 feet to 20 feet .... 24%
So, what's a shotgun or AR15 gonna do within ten feet?
FBI 9MM Justification
FBI Training Division: FBI Academy, Quantico, VA
Executive Summary of Justification for Law Enforcement Partners
· Caliber debates have existed in law enforcement for decades
· Most of what is “common knowledge” with ammunition and its effects on the human target are rooted in myth and folklore
· Projectiles are what ultimately wound our adversaries and the projectile needs to be the basis for the discussion on what “caliber” is best
· In all the major law enforcement calibers there exist projectiles which have a high likelihood of failing LEO’s in a shooting incident and there are projectiles which have a high likelihood of succeeding for LEO’s in a shooting incident
· Handgun stopping power is simply a myth
· The single most important factor in effectively wounding a human target is to have penetration to a scientifically valid depth (FBI uses 12” – 18”)
· LEO’s miss between 70 – 80 percent of the shots fired during a shooting incident
· Contemporary projectiles (since 2007) have dramatically increased the terminal effectiveness of many premium line law enforcement projectiles (emphasis on the 9mm Luger offerings)
· 9mm Luger now offers select projectiles which are, under identical testing conditions, I outperforming most of the premium line .40 S&W and .45 Auto projectiles tested by the FBI
· 9mm Luger offers higher magazine capacities, less recoil, lower cost (both in ammunition and wear on the weapons) and higher functional reliability rates (in FBI weapons)
· The majority of FBI shooters are both FASTER in shot strings fired and more ACCURATE with shooting a 9mm Luger vs shooting a .40 S&W (similar sized weapons)
· There is little to no noticeable difference in the wound tracks between premium line law Auto enforcement projectiles from 9mm Luger through the .45 Auto
· Given contemporary bullet construction, LEO’s can field (with proper bullet selection) 9mm Lugers with all of the terminal performance potential of any other law enforcement pistol caliber with none of the disadvantages present with the “larger” calibers
The Colt should be a beaut with special family history. I enjoy all the guns that were handed down to me.
Might be a good idea to check to see if you can shoot hot +p loads in it.
If his f-i-l is as old as I expect, I would doubt +Ps were around when the pistol was made.
Exactly, Sam L. I guess it was more of a warning. Poor syntax on my part.
Never really handled a revolver, although knew where my dad kept it. Like BD, we had a couple of shotguns and a 22 in the kitchen entry of our farm house. It was entirely unremarkable for the time and place. The 22 was for woodchucks and tin cans; the 12 gauge was for shooting pigeons as they flew off the silo.
".50 caliber handgun: For those times when there is a burglar behind the refrigerator... at your neighbor's house. "
I agree with you on the Taurus ("The Judge" it's called because that's the weapon of choice for judges to carry into the courtroom).
I carry one in my car. Being able to fire both .45 caps and .410 shotgun loads gives one a comfortable feeling. Never had to use mine - hope I never have to.
Wall penetration is a big worry for me with any home defense weapon. The 410 seems to be a reasonable balance of lethality and inanimate non-penetration.
It all seems so foreign to me. I wouldn't think twice about giving or selling a gun to someone I know. If it's to someone out of state they need to drive here to do it in person or I need to ship it to a dealer that will be the middle man, for a fee of course. The dealer is probably then required to do a background check.
I would never, under any circumstances, register a gun. Fortunately, in my state I don't need to. I don't even like the idea of applying for a concealed/open carry permit.
From what I understand about Alaska, you can open carry with no permit or registration required. My kind of state, except for the cold and long nights. I'm curious if anyone can confirm that about Alaska.
First priority is to use a firearm with which you are proficient. Don't catch your head on pistol, semi-auto, rifle, shotgun;
Second is the anticipated scenario: inside the house, dark to low light conditions, number of assailants;
Third priority is — do not hesitate. Shooting perhaps killing another human being is like no other experience and there is no time to ponder. Put the actions in motion and follow through. I have been in several lethal force encounters and, no, it didn't get any easier.
BTW, I am against firearm registration. I comply when I have to, render unto Caesar, so forth, but in your situation I would not register the pistol. Just my opinion; I live in Borderland New Mexico and things are different down here.
Lt.T.C. “Pidge” Robinson, Texas Ranger
15) Forget about knives, bats and fists. Bring a gun. Preferably, bring at least two guns. Bring all of your friends who have guns. Bring four times the ammunition you think you could ever need.
14) Anything worth shooting is worth shooting twice. Ammunition is cheap - life is expensive. If you shoot inside, buckshot is your friend. A new wall is cheap - funerals are expensive
13) If your shooting stance is good, you're probably not moving fast enough or using cover correctly.
12) If you are not shooting, you should be communicating, reloading, and running. Yell "Fire!" Why "Fire"? Cops will come with the Fire Department, sirens often scare off the bad guys, or at least cause then to lose concentration and will.... and who is going to summon help if you yell "Intruder," "Glock" or "Winchester?"
11) Accuracy is relative: most combat shooting standards will be more dependent on "pucker factor" than the inherent accuracy of the gun.
10) Practice shooting in the dark, with someone shouting at you, when out of breath, etc.
9) Have a back-up plan, because the first one won't work. "No battle plan ever survives 10 seconds past first contact with an enemy."
8) Watch their hands. Hands kill. Smiles, frowns and other facial expressions don't (In God we trust. Everyone else keep your hands where I can see them.)
7) Anything worth shooting is worth shooting twice. (See above)
6) The faster you finish the fight, the less shot you will get.
5) Stretch the rules. Always win. The only unfair fight is the one you lose.
4) Regardless of whether justified of not, you will feel sad about killing another human being. It is better to be sad than to be room temperature.
3) Someday someone may kill you with your own gun, but they should have to beat you to death with it because it is empty.
2) In ten years nobody will remember the details of caliber, stance, or tactics. They will only remember who lived.
1) The only thing you EVER say afterwards is, "He said he was going to kill me. I believed him. I'm sorry, Officer, but I'm very upset now. I can't say anything more. Please speak with my attorney."