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Tuesday, November 10. 2009A matter of definition - The Fort Hood reporting
My first reaction to a Muslim shooting up the place was, "Here we go again!" (I was ever the cynical one.) My second reaction was, "Stand by for all the 'Muslims fear reprisals' articles in the MSM." (Practical, too.) But my third reaction was, "Hey, wait a sec..." Spot the incorrect word:
And from yesterday's Best of the Web Today column by James Taranto:
Agreed. It didn't take long before it occurred to me that, by definition, "terrorism" means killing civilians, not soldiers. Thanks to James for stating it perfectly. And, by way of Instapundit, a couple of sharp quotes on the subject: In regards to the liberal MSM's worry about the 'Muslim backlash', here's Michael Nehring writing on Facebook:
And in regards to the American press doing its usual dance around the matter of the perpetrator's Muslim faith and its bearing on the event (as highly evidenced in a number of the above headlines and quotes), here's David Warren:
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I agree that the correct word here is treason. And I wouldn't be surprised is Hasan was brought up on treason charges.
No, there's nothing in the definition of "terrorism" which delineates the status of the victims.
There is no universally agreed-upon definition of "terrorism", but here is the gist Terrorism is the unlawful use of violence against persons or property to inculcate fear in order to coerce governments or civilians into actions which further political or social objectives. The key words in that definition are: 1. unlawful 2. inculcate fear 3. coercion 4. further...objectives By the nature of terrorism, the victims are NOT the targets. The targets are the survivors. The objective of a terrorist attack is the REACTION of the living to the attack. Terrorism can be committed by one person. If Nidal's objective was to cause fear such that we would divert resources away from military missions, cause an overreaction against muslims, or cause revulsion against the war, then his act could be defined as terrorist in nature. If his only objective was to kill US soldiers who were going to or coming from fighting a war "against" muslims, it's not terrorism - it's garden variety murder. Clearly he had extremist views. If he survives, he may attempt to turn murder into terrorism by entering the Exploitation Phase of a terrorist attack. He will accomplish this by making statements which turn his attack into something bigger than he originally expected it to be. Back to the definition, military action itself is horrific, but warfare is a LAWFUL act - the Geneva Convention states as much, passing no judgment whatever on the reasons or causes of war. Psychological Operations sometimes deliberately inculcate fear but, again, this is a LAWFUL act of war. The Al Qaeda attack against the USS Cole was indeed a terrorist attack. It's goal was to drive American warships out of Yemen. Similarly, the attack on the Marine Barracks in Lebanon was a terrorist attack and succeeded in causing a withdrawal of US forces. Terrorist operations use a variety of methods including murder, bombings, arson, hijacking, hostage barricade, disfigurement, theft, kidnapping, etc. Terrorists are usually not prosecuted for "terrorism" but rather for the underlying crimes, although after 9/11 the scope of laws involving the planning, preparation, and conduct of terrorist attacks was added. This was meant to make acts and intentions which would have led to death and destruction a prosecutable offense. It was merely closing a loophole in law, not defining a new, dramatic way to describe murder. It might be an aggravating factor to murder (like hate crimes) but when you've killed a dozen or more people, the reason why really doesn't matter anymore with respect to aggravating conditions. "And in regards to the American press doing its usual dance around the matter of the perpetrator's [MUSLIM] faith."
Fixed it for you. If he were a Christian, esp. Roman Catholic, the press would have been on it like a maggot on a dead rabbit. POWinCA - Well, you make some good points, but, as you said, the definition is up for grabs. And if you're looking for a nice, easy, clear-cut definition, I can't think of anything better than "killing soldiers" and "killing civilians". Everything after that seems somewhat secondary.
Rob - You raise an interesting question. Is the military punishment for treason still the firing squad? Wow, what a ruckus that wouldl make! " Results 1 - 10 of about 18,700,000 for what is the meaning of 'terrorism'?."
Almost 19 million hits on Google for 'terrorism'. Hasan committed a terrorist act, and in doing so, also committed treason. David Warren: " the reports of the Fort Hood massacre were almost as provoking as what happened there. In the larger view of things, they may be more consequential." What is he thinking? Guns and bullets may kill me, but words will hurt me more? In fact, the lack of words caused this terrorist act, but it wasn't the MSM we should be pointing fingers at as the military heard all the reports about Hasan's leanings a couple of years before this erupted and did nothing about it. Why? Lack of words. PC rules in the military, and no one wanted to take the fall for tattling on a Muslim. Political correctness has now morphed into a weapon of death and into asinine commentary such as this post gleefully positing treason as the crime. Assholery writ large is this crap. ` ` AC - Excellent point, and the post has been updated. And I italicized Muslim so the more astute readers would pick up on exactly what you said. Good catch on your part.
An act may be terrorism and treason simultaneously. Hasan's attack was on soldiers, but soldiers he knew would be without weapons. Attacking people because they can't fight back sounds terroristic to me.
His action could easily be construed as "making war against the United States, or giving aid or comfort to the enemy". That would meet the Constitutional definition of treason. But I think it's easier to use 13 murder counts than one count of treason. The military switched the method of execution to lethal injection some 20 years ago but has not carried out a death sentence since a soldier was hanged in 1961. Military courts have issued death sentences since then but none have been carried out. Geoff - That's a very interesting point you make, about him knowing the soldiers were unarmed. Does that make them "temporary civilians", so to speak, at that point? That appears to make sense on one hand, but if an enemy platoon knew an American platoon was out of ammunition and so mercilessly attacked them, would it change the ground rules? Not really. It would still be enemy vs. enemy, and armament inventory be damned.
I certainly agree with you about charging him with murder over treason, though. "Treason" probably needs some form of premeditation, like first-degree murder, whereas with a general murder charge, the dead bodies speak for themselves. Howdy, Dr. Mercury
Fort Hood is not the field of battle; Major Hasan was not a member of the Iraqi Armed Forces before the fall of Sadam. The rules of the battlefield require that the soldiers in the field use every advantage: capturing or destroying the enemy when the ammo runs out is within the rules of war. I might point out that, under the Geneva rules as played out in WWII, a unit would be expected to demand the surrender of an incapacitated enemy unit before destroying it. Battlefield rules just don't apply to Hasan's case. I suggest 13 counts of premeditated murder because it's easy to prove. He bought guns and brought them on post into an area where he was not supposed to have weapons and where he knew the soldiers in the line of fire wouldn't have weapons. Assan Akbar, the fragging soldier from Kuwait, is on Death Row for a similar incident. Making a treason charge would be reasonable to me except that it would be a legal circus. Goeff -
"Fort Hood is not the field of battle" Agreed, as far as Geneva goes, but Hasan would argue the point. He'd say that, at that moment, he was definitely on the 'field of battle' -- and others there might agree. "Assan Akbar, the fragging soldier from Kuwait, is on Death Row for a similar incident." Is that a military 'death row'? Bruce, up above, says the military doesn't execute people any more, which would kind of reduce it to just "row". "Making a treason charge would be reasonable to me except that it would be a legal circus." Jeez, would it ever. It'll be interesting to see how the legalistics work out. There are going to be certain aspects that'll be mandated just from the fact that it happened on a military base. They may have to try him for "treason", rather than the Homeland Security-style "terrorist acts". It's no "OJ", but it should be interesting to watch the court drama play out. Meta -
You missed something, dear heart: Treason is worse than terrorism. The punishment for terrorism is a few years behind bars and time off for good behavior. The classic punishment for treason is death. So, which one would you rather see this scumbag tried for? The argument about terrorism vs treason vs murder is largely a waste of time. He is an American citizen who committed mass murder on a US Army base within the United States, and subject to military justice (which does also have euphemistic penalties under UCMJ for what some refer to as "hate crimes"). UCMJ does allow the death penalty for murder.
Regardless of his motives, he committed murders. The military justice system, if not interfered with by Obama's legal loonies, can handle this, with reasonable dispatch. To add fuel to the fire, I personally don't believe in the death penalty, as I don't believe in giving any government that much power. He can rot in Leavenworth for life. The primary outcome to be hoped for is greater attention to those who might be liable to violence, and lesser attention to the PC restrictions that have crippled our vigilence. For that, concentrate on the Obama-types who have created such barriers to common-sense prevention, as they did before 9/11 and are trying to do again by putting up legalistic barriers to finding, capturing, interrogating, imprisoning, and trying foreign terrorists and enemies. One need not get lost in the dead-end of what is a Muslim. One must simply recognize enemies and threats from wherever they come, especially when right in front of our faces, and deal with them with overwhelming measures and force as needed. Another outcome to be hoped for is the elimination of the over-expansive attribution of PTSD to too many, when studies actually show the severe incidence is a fraction of numbers tossed about in the liberal press, to cripple our defense, and by the self-serving psych industry that has grown to profit from it. This murderer was not suffering PTSD. He was suffering being a totally conscious and self-responsible person with radical beliefs and friends. Terrorism or criminality, we all know what it was and any arguing is just more angels dancing on the head of a pin nonsense. He was and is a terrorist and sudden Jihad syndrome is something we will have to live with for many years to come.
Meta and Bruce ... Am with you both on this question. Meta says "political correctness has now morphed into a weapon of death". Whatever you want to call PC. it consistently proves to be an impediment to clear thought and right decisions.
Bruce, as usual you've cut to the heart of things by pointing out that "the argument about terrorism vs. treason vs. murder is largely a waste of time." And a delaying tactic to protect one's butt. In the case of PC pussyfooters, a deliberate one. As I noted last night in my comment about the Fort Hood slaughter,, PC thought is actually intellectual laziness, another excuse to keep from having to do the tough stuff, make wise decisions which are difficult but necessary choices. PC and multiculturalism are a sometimes deliberate obfuscation, by those who espouse them, to keep themselves from hanging out there twisting in the wind, as some politico once put it. Goodness -- anything but that! Marianne OOhhh ... and one more thing. Dorothy Rabinowitz, who can be a terror herself when her clear, fierce mind attacks a deserving target, has a fine editorial in today's Wall Street Journal Opinion page on this very subject.
Warning to all sometimes thoughtless pundits and PC pussyfooters: Watch out. "The female of the species is sometimes deadlier than the male." Especially when her cubs are threatened. Marianne Bruce -
"The argument about terrorism vs treason vs murder is largely a waste of time." Well, you're right in the sense that there isn't much "argument" to be had over mere definitions, which is what the post was about. Definitions are, by definition, definitive. One could ramble on all day about the definition of the word "terrorism", but once it's broken down into "soldiers" and "civilians", it's pretty clear-cut. "He can rot in Leavenworth for life." I presume you saw my post about Beautiful Camp Elmwood. Okay, here's a pragmatic question for you. Let's say that while we might believe he deserves death, we'd rather have him stew in a cell for the rest of his days. With no TiVo, I quickly point out, just to show how harsh his sentence will be. Is it worth the money? At $55K/yr (or whatever it is these days to house a prisoner), times 40 or 50 years, is it worth the money to know he's languishing his life away in a cell? I mean, I like the spirit of the thing, but the monetary aspect is serious. How 'bout if we split the difference, give him 20 years, then the chair? "This murderer was not suffering PTSD." Not that anything about this travesty was comical, but one of the more amusing moments had to have been when the liberal media starting talking about Pre-Traumatic Stress Disorder. I wonder if that'll be his defense. "being a totally conscious and self-responsible person with radical beliefs" Yeah, shouting "Allahu Akbar!" while shooting people is usually the tip-off. :) DocMerc: I stand by letting him rot in Leavenworth, and not any country club federal farm. And, I stand by letting him do so for life, though costly.
If cost is the overriding issue, we wouldn't have children either! Big B -
"I stand by letting him rot in Leavenworth, and not any country club federal farm." Now hold on there, fella. Let's not jump overboard in the 'cruelty' department. No TiVo and you want to take away his swimming pool privileges? Boy, could the ACLU make mincemeat out of you. For example, would you deny him exercise? Well, that's why they built that nice racketball court. Do you deny him freedom from pain? Hence the jacuzzi for those sore, aching muscles after the racketball match. I could go on and on, but I think you get the point. Loose talk like the above on your part almost smacks of 'torture' -- and you know how sensitive everybody is to that! Say, I just had a fun thought. What if his lawyer outfoxes everybody and, rather than spending the rest of his days in some cold, dank cell, he gets sentenced to...Palau! (cue Hawaiian music) "If cost is the overriding issue, we wouldn't have children either!" Zing! Marianne -
"Whatever you want to call PC, it consistently proves to be an impediment to clear thought and right decisions." Everyone here agrees with this point. The post, however, was about definitions. "Bruce, as usual you've cut to the heart of things by pointing out that "the argument about terrorism vs. treason vs. murder is largely a waste of time." Actually, I was surprised he said that. Since when is discussing the English language a "waste of time"? Or, perhaps more to the point, if someone doesn't want to discuss the many and varied nuances of the English language, why comment at all? "PC thought is actually intellectual laziness, another excuse to keep from having to do the tough stuff" I might argue the point. Speaking as a male, it takes all kinds of mental energy in order to not say something sexist in public, like "policeman" or "mailman". If there are females within earshot, you've got to think ahead. That's hardly the definition of "lazy". And isn't that also true being around blacks, Jews, Muslims, and all the other 'victimized' groups? It could be argued that being PC takes a tremendous amount of mental energy. I read the WSJ post but it didn't offer much of anything new to someone who's been following the blogs & links. It's nice to see the perils of PC put on public display, though. Not that it'll do any good. Like you, I was already an adult when PC started sticking its claws into societal convention and watched it grow to the beast it is today. I am a'feared that it'll still be here long after we're gone. Doc Merc ... I'm arguing that we shouldn't waste energy trying to observe rules of thought and conversation that we ourselves don't believe in. Indeed, being PC takes a tremendous amount of energy. So why don't we grown-ups just opt out? Then we'd have more energy to fight back with more forceful intellectual arguments, if we aren't wasting our time biting out tongues and talking on an infantile level. These folks are setting the rules of our debate and, IIRC my training in debate, you don't let your opponent do that, if you want to win.
Marianne Marianne -
"So why don't we grown-ups just opt out?" That is probably the best question ever asked on this site. And no, I don't have any kind of answer. I guess we all just let it grow during the 80's because we thought it was a fad, and that eventually people would come to their senses and start talking 'real talk' again. But, as we've seen, it's only gotten worse and worse and worse. Look at the 'hate crimes' bill that just passed. The Juggernaut is rolling and we're in the path of its mighty wheels. Doc, I hope you continue to post on topics that interest you here at Maggie's. This has been an interesting an entertaining thread.
FM - One of the interesting things about blogging is how radically different the comments can turn out compared to what direction you thought they'd take. In this case, I thought three people would say, "Hey, thanks for pointing that out!" and that'd be the end of it. After all, I didn't opine on anything myself, and the three quotes were hardly controversial. But, as you said, it turned out quite entertaining, and especially when you-know-who arrived. Jack Daniels and psychotropic drugs really don't mix very well, do they?
Re the direction of comments: Agreed. The unpredictable direction of comments following a post has always fascinated me. I think the way the comments often meander reflects actual conversation. It is just something to be expected. But what is also interesting is the tone of the comments. Sometimes the hostility or enthusiasm for a particular subject is far different than I would imagine.
FM -
"I think the way the comments often meander reflects actual conversation." That's a very perceptive point. The way I phrase it is, "The average blog comments stay on-topic for 3.2 comments." Usually, the first two or three -- even four! -- comments stay on-topic, then, like conversations, they head off in any old direction. Again, a good point on your part. "Sometimes the hostility or enthusiasm for a particular subject is far different than I would imagine." Amen, brudder. I was obviously surprised by the hostility in this thread, but, upon reflection, it might have been that a certain number of people were just dying to spout off on the subject and this seemed like the place to do it. On the flip side, sometimes you just know what's coming. There are, obviously, a bunch of Palin supporters in the Hot Air crowd, but one of the main bloggers, Allahpundit, is a Palin-basher, so every time he posts a link by some fellow Palin-basher, my how the fur doth fly! By the same token, 'controversy sells' in the blogosphere, so (for all we know) it might all be part of a master plan. Thanks again for the interesting comments, Doc M:
Intemperate and insulting comments are not tolerated here. Stop with that now. BD Thanks, BD. Her more-offensive comments have been deleted.
Back to the subject, one unexpected debate that sprung out of this post was whether it would be better to try him for treason or terrorism. A friend emailed me last night and made a fairly passionate argument for the latter. He made some lesser points, but the main gist was that "treason" will make the whole thing seem like some kind of 'domestic problem', whereas he wants to keep the word "terrorism" in the public eye, and that's especially true with what people like Mark Steyn call "the war on the war on terror" -- that is, the PC Brigade who want to sweep any Muslim-related travesty under the rug. On this, I agree, and definitions be damned. As one wag put it, several years ago (The Onion? Scrappleface? Iowahawk?): headline:
IMAMS WARN AGAINST ANTI-MUSLIM BACKLASH AFTER TOMORROW'S TERROR BOMBINGS |